AC softcap and low level hardcap discussion

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Ripqozko [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

**RAID ATTENDANCE Deathssilkymist#0**```md
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It is always great to see how much Ripqozko misses me. Thanks for the support! I'll raid with you again someday, do not worry.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Did two tests on Shiel Glimmerspindle.

=========================================
363 AC Test, Lodi Shield in Back Slot, Nothing in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 381
22, 22
25, 33
28, 28
32, 35
35, 39
38, 27
42, 37
45, 37
48, 38
52, 28
55, 32
58, 23
62, 41
65, 41
68, 41
72, 44
75, 31
78, 33
82, 9

Total Damage = 39236

=========================================
363 AC Test, Nothing in Back Slot, Lodi Shield in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 418
22, 29
25, 35
28, 45
32, 29
35, 22
38, 34
42, 36
45, 32
48, 33
52, 25
55, 29
58, 37
62, 32
65, 30
68, 31
72, 29
75, 30
78, 40
82, 4

Total Damage = 37110

As you can see, the damage reduction is greater when the Lodi Shield is in the Secondary Slot, rather than the Back Slot. I fought a level 40 mob as requested to show that the "squelch point" is not a factor.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

I forgot to mention, the two tests in the previous post were 1000 hits per test:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=162

[TytosOfEight]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Did two tests on Shiel Glimmerspindle.

=========================================
363 AC Test, Lodi Shield in Back Slot, Nothing in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 381
22, 22
25, 33
28, 28
32, 35
35, 39
38, 27
42, 37
45, 37
48, 38
52, 28
55, 32
58, 23
62, 41
65, 41
68, 41
72, 44
75, 31
78, 33
82, 9

Total Damage = 39236

=========================================
363 AC Test, Nothing in Back Slot, Lodi Shield in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 418
22, 29
25, 35
28, 45
32, 29
35, 22
38, 34
42, 36
45, 32
48, 33
52, 25
55, 29
58, 37
62, 32
65, 30
68, 31
72, 29
75, 30
78, 40
82, 4

Total Damage = 37110

As you can see, the damage reduction is greater when the Lodi Shield is in the Secondary Slot, rather than the Back Slot. I fought a level 40 mob as requested to show that the "squelch point" is not a factor.

This is starting to paint a much clearer picture. I have to admit, it’s a bit disappointing that the shield in the back slot doesn’t function the same way as it does in the offhand. That said, it’ll be fascinating to see if any AC items can act as a shield in the offhand, or if there’s something unique about the coding specifically for items labelled as both “shield” + “offhand.”

Keep up the good work, and just ignore the trolls.

[Jimjam]

I’d bet it does have to be a shield, not just ac (since shield is clearly an existing flag as it is checked for bash). This would be a little sad for the shield of the slain unicorn (which is a piercing weapon but not a shield). I wonder how the fiery defender works for shield ac (which unlike a shield worn on the back does unlock bash, so is a shield in that regard but is AC weapon worn in primary).

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by TytosOfEight [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is starting to paint a much clearer picture. I have to admit, it’s a bit disappointing that the shield in the back slot doesn’t function the same way as it does in the offhand. That said, it’ll be fascinating to see if any AC items can act as a shield in the offhand, or if there’s something unique about the coding specifically for items labelled as both “shield” + “offhand.”

Keep up the good work, and just ignore the trolls.

Thanks for the support!

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I’d bet it does have to be a shield, not just ac (since shield is clearly an existing flag as it is checked for bash). This would be a little sad for the shield of the slain unicorn (which is a piercing weapon but not a shield). I wonder how the fiery defender works for shield ac (which unlike a shield worn on the back does unlock bash, so is a shield in that regard but is AC weapon worn in primary).

Yeah people have been saying items like orbs (Orb of the Infinite Void for example) do not count as shields for years. You are also correct that shields must have a special flag so bash can work properly.

I may do a test on this at some point for completions sake, but I haven't really seen anyone claim that any item with AC in the offhand counts as a shield. Nor do I expect this to be the case.

Haynar specified "Shield AC" when he was talking about it increasing softcap. He didn't say something generic like "Offhand AC".

The EQEMU code also has a specific check for shields.

[Jimjam]

Does the sk epic work like paladin one? That it can bash and has AC?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Does the sk epic work like paladin one? That it can bash and has AC?

SK epic can bash. It doesn't have AC though. Probably due to the SK Epic's proc already being such a good defensive proc.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Did one more test without any shield in back or secondary. All tests are 1000 hits. Reposting the first two for easy viewing. This is against https://wiki.project1999.com/Shiel_Glimmerspindle .

=======================================
363 AC Test, Nothing in Back Slot, Nothing in Secondary Slot
=======================================

DV, Count
19, 373
22, 37
25, 33
28, 31
32, 25
35, 45
38, 26
42, 37
45, 32
48, 36
52, 30
55, 32
58, 41
62, 27
65, 44
68, 29
72, 34
75, 46
78, 33
82, 9

Total Damage = 39093

=========================================
363 AC Test, Lodi Shield in Back Slot, Nothing in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 381
22, 22
25, 33
28, 28
32, 35
35, 39
38, 27
42, 37
45, 37
48, 38
52, 28
55, 32
58, 23
62, 41
65, 41
68, 41
72, 44
75, 31
78, 33
82, 9

Total Damage = 39236

=========================================
363 AC Test, Nothing in Back Slot, Lodi Shield in Secondary Slot
=========================================

DV, Count
19, 418
22, 29
25, 35
28, 45
32, 29
35, 22
38, 34
42, 36
45, 32
48, 33
52, 25
55, 29
58, 37
62, 32
65, 30
68, 31
72, 29
75, 30
78, 40
82, 4

Total Damage = 37110

This shows that shield AC in the secondary slot does affect mitigation. This is due to the shield AC increasing your softcap. Sadly shield AC in the back slot does nothing. The NPC I was fighting is level 40, so this means the "squelch point" is not affecting the result. My current thought is that the "squelch point" isn't an actual mechanic.

[Jimjam]

I think this q is a and a but have you tried a shield in back and secondary simultaneously?