Tumpy Tonic

[Pimp1]

Originally Posted by magic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

46 - 44 = 2

You're fucking sick at math bro. Tutor me?

Don't know what that mean, but ok. We should have kept this quest running and have everyone just level in Freeport. Have Tantalar provide people with that GM money

[IAMJOE]

As a player in the days when the Tumpy Tonic quest was on live, I have to say I'm having trouble understanding the idea that Tumpy Tonics quest on the "Classic" EMU server is a cheat.

The quest is in my opinion similar to Manastone and Jboots etc.

The case I am making here is not that the quest didn't give people unfair advantage in the early days of Everquest, anymore than I would argue that any of the overpowered items nerfed by sony over the first months of EQ give players unfair advantage over those who did not get them pre-nerf. In the early days of EQ, lots of people used Tumpy Tonics to level quickly, it was very common and lasted until the quest was nerfed. WHEN the quest was nerfed, there was no punishment for using the quest, any more than there was punishment or removal of Manastones from people's inventory.

There is a bit of confusion here for players who did not, I think, understand the dividing line between what the developers of this EMU server intended to be "Classic" and therefore still included despite Sony's (and the rest of the planet's) decision to nerf on live EQ servers and what the developers of this EMU server have decided is game breaking and should be removed (despite it's inclusion and eventual nerf on live servers).

Project1999 has been recognized for, among other things, being a place where players can engage in content as it existed before it was removed by Sony or Verant. Clearly, as a well remembered quest that was engaged in by thousands of players on every server, Tumpy Tonics is a quest "old schoolers" would look forward to. The fact that it was reverted back to it's former EXP gain indicates that someone along the line agreed.

Also, a point of confusion appears to be that the some developers did not know about Tumpy Tonics. Tumpy Tonics are very fondly remembered by large portions of the EQ community, and the quest is not a 'bug', but clearly a quest that existed on EQ Live (until being nerfed) in an identical form as it existed on this EMU server a few days ago:

"lol the 'bard' class button during creating would be broken, i bet. It would be nice to get a mana stone and a mask of deception though. Also to kill a boat would be fun. Ooo and the tumpy tonic quest would be cool."
Discussion of a EQ server minus nerfs:
http://74.55.118.12/showthread.php?t=1108&page=2

"People did the Tumpy Tonic quest...for xp....alot... "
Post entitled "Can you remember..." Enchanter Forum
http://www.therunes.net/forums/viewt...hp?f=40&t=7006

"Well, I guess I wont be getting my vambraces soon. They took Tumpy out, so getting a tonic is impossible. WOO!"
Discussion about how to obtain Tumpy Tonics from practitioners of the Brewing skill, Helps date the Nerf of Tumpy Tonic Quest experience.
http://eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=7513

"Btw, Tumpy Tonics wasn't a cheat, nor a bug.
The quest was supposed to give faction and xp, and it did.
However, Verant hadn't forseen the industrial scale that people would do the quest on."
Thread entitled "Old School"
http://ayonae.com/sitemap/old-school-t389.html

"I remember doing the Tumpy Tonic quest over and over again and getting experience like crazy."
http://www.allakhazam.com/forum.html...59829318049227

As you can see, the quest gave the correct amount of exp to reflect an accurate 1999 EQ environment.

And for this reason, the developers of Project1999 unwittingly set in motion, for lack of a better word, a "trap" for old school players.

They advertised a server where the "Classic" experience could be lived again. They offered a Pre-Nerf experience, and they set the Tumpy Tonic quest exp back to as it existed in classic EQ. True to form, the first things people raced for on this server were Pre-Nerf items and quests. Imagine everyone's surprise when Tumpy Tonics gave 3000+ exp! (The quest was nerfed from 3000+ to 5 exp) Their first thought was "I LOVE THIS SERVER!"

The assumption, because of the advertising, of old school players was that it was included on purpose, and not an exploit. Figuring the quest was set purposefully to pre-nerf status, I think most people assumed the developers would follow the time-line on Live servers, as they plan to do with other "classic" content, and nerf the quest when it was originally nerfed on live (or, after a few months like Manastone etc.)

You can see the confusion here in pointing fingers and throwing accusations about exploits, because I can't seem to find a list that separates and divides what truly broken and overpowered "Classic" content is allowed and what truly broken and overpowered "Classic" content is an exploit.

[yaaaflow]

Perhaps you didn't notice the part where the kiola nuts were incorrectly stackable, making it possible to carry like 3000 of them instead of the 80 possible on live EQ? Making the quest ridiculously broken to an extent it never was on live?

[IAMJOE]

Perhaps you didn't notice the part where the kiola nuts were incorrectly stackable, making it possible to carry like 3000 of them instead of the 80 possible on live EQ? Making the quest ridiculously broken to an extent it never was on live?

I understand that, but is that really the issue? If that is all anyone is complaining about and not the fact that the quest is giving pre-nerf exp then that seems perfectly fine to me.

I was under the impression that people were upset that the quest was giving so much exp.

Why would they nerf the exp of the quest and not just make the nuts non-stakable? That seems like a weird fix.

The rational part of my brain is telling me that the stacking issue isn't the primary issue. The stacking issue only made the quest more rapidly done, not more likely to be done often.

Or are you saying that everyone who has made a big deal about this being an exploit would be fine keeping the quest in and just making the nuts non-stackable? (and by extension anyone who did the quest a 'reasonable' number of times, say 50 trips to OOT or 80 x 50 = 4000 Tumpy Tonics shouldn't get beat by the nerf bat)

No, I think the stacking issue helped non-casting classes no doubt (the translocator is in BB so binding at Tumpy practically solves the stacking issue), but lets face it, who really plays non-casters anyway? (<---joke)

[yaaaflow]

Since it would take (just cribbing from your math) about 30 times as long to get the same experience with the nuts non stackable, yeah I'd say that would slow things down to a rate where people wouldn't see it as such a big deal.

[emubird]

Also, the lack of boats/travel delay in getting the kiola nuts amplified the server impact of this exploit.

Regarding culpability: everybody who did the quest in the classic era knew the nuts were not stackable. They also would have remembered the 30 to 40minute delays from island to dock, each way. Honest players who simply wanted to do the tumpy tonic quest 'as it was available in classic' would have reported the stacking kiola nuts immediately. Without the travel time from boats, this quest has been exploited in ways people couldn't have dreamed of in classic.

[Myrkskog]

The instant translocators combined with being bound at the dwarf in Freeport would make an 80 tonic run take like 10 minutes. 480 tonics an hour is still ridiculous experience, so this is definately about the amount of exp the tonics were giving, not the amount of tonics that could be done in a single run. Making the nuts unstackable wouldn't deter anyone from doing the quest from 1-50 as long as they had the money.

I understand that the Project 1999 crew has worked extremely hard to make this server awesome, and that Tumpy Tonics trivializes a lot of their efforts(lets face it, if any of us worked as hard as they did, we would see this quest as a slap in the face as well). But punishing people for running a quest that was a staple of Classic EQ seems more like a reaction to protect "their baby" than a objective look at the situation.

Should the quest experience be nerfed to nothing/removed? Yes, but it's hard to justify punishing the people who did it when it was legitimately available.

[Myrkskog]

Originally Posted by emubird [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Without the travel time from boats, this quest has been exploited in ways people couldn't have dreamed of in classic.

Were people doing the tonics supposed to sit and wait for an hour before each turn in to mimic how it was on live when the majority of the server supports instant transportation?

You can't have it both ways. Either everyone waits, or nobody waits. A person using the translocator to run nuts isn't exploiting any more than a person using the translocator to meet up with their group.

[Dabamf]

The nuts were stackable making you able to carry TWENTY times the amount. Of course that's an absolutely major bug.

[Bannedfornoreason]

So the people like me who were told the quest was amazing exp and perfect for leveling in a lame way but a legit way by those who played in classic should be punished because since we didn't play back then, we didn't know that Kiola nut was not stackable? That sounds insane to me...People are getting banned because they didn't know that kiola nut was not stackable. Are there some who knew it was not supposed to be stackable and did it anyway? Yeah obviously but it looks like it was assumed that every knew that. Its laughable to think that they did.