Raid Changes

[Elements]

Originally Posted by Alarti0001 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Pretty much this

Fix for everyone? With no GM or Dev intervention?

How bout guilds agree to a very late window rotation? Simple and saves us from socking. The details could be discussed but basically rather than 150 people on a spawn for a "lottery" all night that you have about 1/3 or so chance of winning, you just get first shot at the mob, if its late window, without the sock. Probably end up being about 1/3rd of the time (more if you are TMO since the other guilds generally don't push targets out of prime time anyway). TMO would likely be losing the same amount of mobs that they currently are to multi-guild socks but without 150+ people wasting endless hours socking.

[Autotune]

instances are not a solution.

stop wasting everyone's time talking about them. The code for it was ripped out and perma deleted.


AKA, not fucking happening.

Carry on with the other suggestions that won't be implemented.

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Elements [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Fix for everyone? With no GM or Dev intervention?

How bout guilds agree to a very late window rotation? Simple and saves us from socking. The details could be discussed but basically rather than 150 people on a spawn for a "lottery" all night that you have about 1/3 or so chance of winning, you just get first shot at the mob, if its late window, without the sock. Probably end up being about 1/3rd of the time (more if you are TMO since the other guilds generally don't push targets out of prime time anyway). TMO would likely be losing the same amount of mobs that they currently are to multi-guild socks but without 150+ people wasting endless hours socking.

Because then everyone else will want to get in on the action. Hey even the A-team will sock trakanon once or twice if that means we can get in on a rotation.

The simple reality of the raiding scene is that there are too many players. So the staff had to do something, to have some criteria to decide which of them would get the pixels. They chose variance, which reduces their workload and gives 100% of the pixels to the people who were the most . . . dedicated. Any solution to the raiding scene has to address this. We have too many players relative to the mobs, so we need more mobs. It is simply the only way. I don't think the amount of loot dropped is quite so important, I think most people would be satisfied if a) they got to do the encounters and b) they would eventually have a shot at stuff, even if it would take a year or whatnot. There are basically two ways to have more mobs:

1) Simultaneous repops, where the existing mobs are concentrated in time
2) More pops, possibly with less loot per mob

My preference would be for both. For example if there were 3 boss mob repops per week with every mob dropping 1/2 the normal loot, with times known in advance. Say Wed @ 6:30 PM ET, Saturday @ 10:00 AM ET, Sunday @ 9:30 PM ET. Most people should be able to make one. Now you just combine this with some anti poopsocking code (say when the boss pops all players are teleported to the zone in, the zone fully repops, and anyone who logs into a dungeon while the boss is up logs in at the safe point), a 'player lock' where if you zone into a 'raid zone' with a boss up, you cannot log on another 50+ toon on the same IP address for say 1 hour, thus preventing the silly camped alts bs that goes on here, and disallow trains in VP, and voila, fixed raid scene.

What would happen: no poopsocking (everyone knows when the stuff will spawn anyway, and you get teleported out), no batphoning (obviously), no tracking (obviously), minimal interference at least at first because everyone is going for different stuff, and the top guilds can only get a few targets each even if they split their forces. And with no trains in VP, TMO/FE/BDA will probably all choose to play in there, at least until Phara Dar is dead. This would be about 1000000 times better than what we have now. I think there are very few people who would disagree with the Loraen Plan. Why Rogean hasn't implemented it, well I guess he has a job and a life and such. TBH if they gave me access to the source I bet I could do it [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anyway Xasten I don't think your plan is bad per se, its just that getting any changes at all has been super hard and if we're going to fight for changes I think they should be good ones.

[Elements]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because then everyone else will want to get in on the action. Hey even the A-team will sock trakanon once or twice if that means we can get in on a rotation.

The simple reality of the raiding scene is that there are too many players. So the staff had to do something, to have some criteria to decide which of them would get the pixels. They chose variance, which reduces their workload and gives 100% of the pixels to the people who were the most . . . dedicated. Any solution to the raiding scene has to address this. We have too many players relative to the mobs, so we need more mobs. It is simply the only way. I don't think the amount of loot dropped is quite so important, I think most people would be satisfied if a) they got to do the encounters and b) they would eventually have a shot at stuff, even if it would take a year or whatnot. There are basically two ways to have more mobs:

1) Simultaneous repops, where the existing mobs are concentrated in time
2) More pops, possibly with less loot per mob

My preference would be for both. For example if there were 3 boss mob repops per week with every mob dropping 1/2 the normal loot, with times known in advance. Say Wed @ 6:30 PM ET, Saturday @ 10:00 AM ET, Sunday @ 9:30 PM ET. Most people should be able to make one. Now you just combine this with some anti poopsocking code (say when the boss pops all players are teleported to the zone in, the zone fully repops, and anyone who logs into a dungeon while the boss is up logs in at the safe point), a 'player lock' where if you zone into a 'raid zone' with a boss up, you cannot log on another 50+ toon on the same IP address for say 1 hour, thus preventing the silly camped alts bs that goes on here, and disallow trains in VP, and voila, fixed raid scene.

What would happen: no poopsocking (everyone knows when the stuff will spawn anyway, and you get teleported out), no batphoning (obviously), no tracking (obviously), minimal interference at least at first because everyone is going for different stuff, and the top guilds can only get a few targets each even if they split their forces. And with no trains in VP, TMO/FE/BDA will probably all choose to play in there, at least until Phara Dar is dead. This would be about 1000000 times better than what we have now. I think there are very few people who would disagree with the Loraen Plan. Why Rogean hasn't implemented it, well I guess he has a job and a life and such. TBH if they gave me access to the source I bet I could do it [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anyway Xasten I don't think your plan is bad per se, its just that getting any changes at all has been super hard and if we're going to fight for changes I think they should be good ones.

If the A team or any other guild wants to get in on a late window rotation fine. Perfect in fact. You get your shot at the plate. You have 10 minutes from spawn to engage on YOUR late window pop, and if you wipe or don't pull it in time TMO cleans it up (most likely). This doesn't kill competition, it kills socking. Guilds will still want to be camped out and ready to snipe it when its not their turn depending on whose turn it is and this requires ZERO from the GMs.

Also note this would only be on a small percentage of the actually pops, those that go to very late in window not every single raid mob pop.

[SupaflyIRL]

Originally Posted by Elements [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the A team or any other guild wants to get in on a late window rotation fine. Perfect in fact. You get your shot at the plate. You have 10 minutes from spawn to engage on YOUR late window pop, and if you wipe or don't pull it in time TMO cleans it up (most likely). This doesn't kill competition, it kills socking. Guilds will still want to be camped out and ready to snipe it when its not their turn depending on whose turn it is and this requires ZERO from the GMs.

Also note this would only be on a small percentage of the actually pops, those that go to very late in window not every single raid mob pop.

So, wouldn't guilds just sock up to the late window designated rotation time instead of the window end time to snipe the mob on their off week?

[Elements]

Originally Posted by SupaflyIRL [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So, wouldn't guilds just sock up to the late window designated rotation time instead of the window end time to snipe the mob on their off week?

No one does this now, why would it be different with a rotation?

The reason people sock now 9 times out of 10 is because a mob is VERY late in their window and you know for a fact that they are going to spawn very soon. Other than some Full Circle 72 hours socking that has been going on lately (wow guys wow) I haven't seen much early-mid window socking going on.

We could also agree amongst ourselves to some sort of entry challenge to get into the rotation. For example your guild must have killed that target at least once (in the last 6 months?) to be eligible for the late window rotation.

It boils down to this. Late window sock your guild has roughly 1/3 chance to lottery the mob. Late window rotation your guild (likely) gets 1/3rd of the late window spawns (more for TMO cause well they can field a force 24/7).

Under the current regime 150+ people typically put in 6 or so hours for 1/3rd the loot.

With a late window rotation a couple trackers have to put in 6 or so hours for 1/3rd the loot and the opportunity for your guild to clean up more if another guild wipes.