Druid vs. Enchanter

[SirAlvarex]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't miss these things, Sir. I've had a bard higher level on the p99 than you have! But these aren't things that are very relevant to the vast majority of groups, and that's what you were talking about when this chanter vs. bard discussion started.

Haha, not quite [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] I was pointing at the versatility a Bard gives to a group made them feel more powerful to me. IE I feel like if a group has a need, as a Bard I can step up and take care of business (except healing and tanking uber mobs).

But I'll stop now. I derailed the thread and didn't mean to do that.

--edit
Missed your edit. I think then that the disagreement comes down to how we perceive the power. I think our last two posts is a great example of us both being on the same page, but with different conclusions. IE I feel like a jack-of-all-trades exhibits more overall power for a group, while the chanters ability to CC/Charm makes them extremely powerful at destroying a mobs HP...plus regen/haste/mez.

[Splorf22]

What is irritating Tecmos and me is that you are like 'yeah, enchanters can charm' and then moving on when in reality the argument should be 'enchanters have long duration charm, therefore nothing else matters'

edit: I should also mention when I did my class selection guide, it ended up being enchanters, monks and shaman are OP, rangers, paladins, druids, and wizards are weak, and everything else is in the middle. Note that this is an average over all situations; in the right situations any class is fantastic.

[SirAlvarex]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What is irritating Tecmos and me is that you are like 'yeah, enchanters can charm' and then moving on when in reality the argument should be 'enchanters have long duration charm, therefore nothing else matters'

edit: I should also mention when I did my class selection guide, it ended up being enchanters, monks and shaman are OP, rangers, paladins, druids, and wizards are weak, and everything else is in the middle. Note that this is an average over all situations; in the right situations any class is fantastic.

Ah, and what sent me off was the complete opposite. Where it was mentioned that Enchanters are uber awesome because of charm, and here us Bards were being ignored when we can do so much for a group.

And I guess I was misinterpreted on long duration charm. I felt it was obvious that that was the corner stone of an enchanters power (plus mez/haste/regen), and my glossing over that was misconstrued. Sorry 'bout that!

I tried leveling a Chanter but couldn't get past 32. Even with Charming the downtime was killing me. I have a 25 Shaman and that's going better with the Fungi/Dragonborn sash/Poison Wind Censer. Can't wait till he gets to the OP zone.

But I'll just go back to my little Bard corner and be content with being such an overlooked class [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] Practically 90% of the groups I get in have to point out that I'm a "good bard", so I feel like I have to defend our class against a stigma that we can't do jack. A Bard-Lobbyist if you will lol.

Okay for real, my last post on the subject. Go back to Druid vs. Enchanter! Nothing to see here!

[Malone88]

Don't think anyone is saying that bards are bad, but chanters a little
better from a grouping standpoint. I think most groups would welcome
either one and groups that have both are rockin' it...[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

IMO, chanters and bards add so much to a group...and I would rank
bards over druids for what they bring to groups, unless you absolutely
need a healer.

[williestargell]

Few points in favor of Druids:

Velious: Overall great for druids. Alot of outdoor zones to solo or group in with animals to charm. Ports and speed are even more important when dealing with three continents. New heals. Undoing alot of nerfs we've seen to make things "classic."

Druid's utility is amazing.

Druids are not the weak link in groups - Backup heals (sometimes main healer), nukes, getting to the zone in half the time, evacs, and snare is enough alone to keep a druid in your group. Good groups are not necessarily those with the most dps, those groups die lots more often too.

Druid's level LOTS faster than enchanters solo.

Numbers favor druids. There are way too many enchanters on p99 server already.

[A1551]

Originally Posted by williestargell [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Few points in favor of Druids:

Velious: Overall great for druids. Alot of outdoor zones to solo or group in with animals to charm. Ports and speed are even more important when dealing with three continents. New heals. Undoing alot of nerfs we've seen to make things "classic."

Druid's utility is amazing.

Druids are not the weak link in groups - Backup heals (sometimes main healer), nukes, getting to the zone in half the time, evacs, and snare is enough alone to keep a druid in your group. Good groups are not necessarily those with the most dps, those groups die lots more often too.

Druid's level LOTS faster than enchanters solo.

Numbers favor druids. There are way too many enchanters on p99 server already.

Lol -- I'm glad you like playing your druid but most of your points above beyond the velious paragraph are pretty laughable. I like to have druids around, I like my druid, he's super useful for mobilization, tracking, etc. But let's be honest -- you need approx 0-1 druids in a group. Every group wants an enchanter (or Bard!), and will just be that much more powerful for having two, or even three. Classic EQ is terribly balanced, stupidly so in many cases. I'd be thrilled if the server had more enchanters..there are NOT "way too many" of us/them around. They are like clerics, the more the merrier [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] What two enchanters can accomplish together in a group is almost unreal.

And druids leveling "LOTS" faster solo? Why would you think that? Druids level fast because then can charm kill animals, and quad things. Both are good experience, but having leveled both ways I guarantee you my chanter was able to kill 4 mobs and med up to full (usually with a high dungeon ZEM) as fast, or sometimes much faster than my druid can gather 4 mobs, quad kite them, and med up to full. At worst I'd say they are comparable. Now if you wanna talk about someone leveling "LOTS" faster than a chanter solo we can talk about bards swarm kiting if you want [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[A1551]

As to the bard/chanter thing...I love bards. I really do. I think it's a travesty they're all too busy swarm kiting in OT to be leveling up in a dungeon somewhere with me because they bring a lot to the table.

My issue with bards is they have all these awesome abilities, but anything they are not actively focusing on doesn't work. So for example, an enchanter casts clarity on the group, the group gets 100% benefit of the clarity, no matter what is going on. Same with haste, etc. I can turn around and CC/slow/stun mobs while dpsing with my pet while everyone enjoys clarity and haste, mobs are slowed etc. Having to CC more mobs does not reduce the effectiveness of my buffs. The bard has to very selectively choose which to do. The more mobs bard is CC'ing means less manasong pulses, or less slowing, or less snaring, or less haste, etc. When things really hit the fan you end up losing your mana regen and haste or whatever precisely when you need it the most. Or if the bard is pulling that means no manasong. I can go pull all night long and the clerics still sitting there enjoying clarity. This isnt a knock on bard's I think its a great mechanic that makes all their very powerful abilities justified. But it is also why I think if I had to choose one over the other I'd rather have the chanter first. I'll happily take both though if the option presents itself :P

[Faerie Blossom]

Druids can use swords, and that's pretty cool imo.

[SirAlvarex]

From a pure strength standpoint, Druids have nothing on Enchanters. Enchanters have better charms and buffs. Those bring a lot to the table that no other class can "do better".

HOWEVER, every enchanter is at the mercy of a Druid when he wants to get around the world quickly [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] . Druids have a lot of strength in the non-combat arena, and unfortunately Verant decided that should be included in combat balance. I mean it's kinda ridiculous when the closest "spelltype" brother to a Druid is a Shaman, and the Shaman not only gets better spells than the druid, but he gets them earlier.

With that said, on our Raids the druids are the second best "xp gank" class we bring along next to Wizards. They can actually put out a lot of burst DPS when they want to.

But still, if you are talking pure power Enchanters were just given such an incredibly stacked hand.

[Vondra]

I actually played a druid first, then an enc second when I came here.

Druid is a good first toon. Easy to get rolling without gear (and most druid stuff is quite cheap too, good for a first character), easy to solo, you can get around no problem with your ports, sell ports for cash etc.

After I got plenty of cash together and my druid was in the low 50s...I started considering a serious character, which led me to enchanter.

Though I don't really "play" the druid anymore, I still use it regularly. When you have a druid alt, it's no problem getting potential groupmates where they need to be. Good go to character for trading stuff to go sell in EC. I wouldn't enjoy the game as much if I had no druid alt and I'm glad I played it first.

I think it's the best first character one can make.