OFFTOPIC: Sense-of-scale In EverQuest!

[Vizax_Xaziv]

I've played many, various MMOs over the decades with the most recent being Classic WOW!

One of the things that's always very striking to me when I go back and play EverQuest is the sense-of-scale that everything has. Specifically, of course, in regards to the playable races! Playing an Ogre/Troll or even just a Human FEELS very different from playing something like a Gnome or Halfling. It really changes your entire perception of the game world!

Why have other MMOs failed to capture this feeling? My guess is that it's simply because EverQuest was designed from the ground up to be a first-person experience and thusly getting the sense-of-scale correct was a high priority for them!

[Danth]

Yep, designing worlds for the third person camera severely inhibits world design. Interiors/etc end up massive caverns to give space for zoomed-out cameras to pivot. This in turn almost prohibits the tight, cramped, twisting dungeon style of EQ. Objects like furniture are quite often scaled outsize so as to not appear tiny to a viewer seeing things through a distant camera.

Danth

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Vizax_Xaziv [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've played many, various MMOs over the decades with the most recent being Classic WOW!

One of the things that's always very striking to me when I go back and play EverQuest is the sense-of-scale that everything has. Specifically, of course, in regards to the playable races! Playing an Ogre/Troll or even just a Human FEELS very different from playing something like a Gnome or Halfling. It really changes your entire perception of the game world!

Amen my brother!

Before I ever made my first character on live I was somewhat in awe of the fact that my friend's gnome actually saw the world from the same perspective as an 8-year old. Coming from D&D, 2D RPGs (think Fallout 1 &2), and bad 3D RPGs (think Bard's Tale and Wizardry), Everquest felt revolutionary in this way, like "the virtual reality future is here: you can be an elf today!" (The enforced first-person perspective was probably a big part too; no mouse wheel back then!)

Obviously the game couldn't fully deliver on that dream, and latter games had much better graphics, but you're totally right that I never felt the same sense of my own character's physical space when I played my Gnome on WoW or my Rodian on SWG, that I do when I play my Halfling or Barbarian here.

[Cen]

My first character was a Dark Elf warrior and I only made it because a friend already had a char on Rathe server.

Then another friend at school was on RZ and convinced me to make a ranger with him in Surefall glade. I was like wait, what the fuck, this is a different game entirely (since I hadn't made it out of nektulous yet on the level 6 warrior, and once walked into lavastorm for a minute.

[Rooj]

I know most people don't play EQ in first person, but I do. I only zoom out if I really need to, to look around a corner or see something I normally wouldn't. I've really wanted a 1st person MMO since EQ. The LACK of perception and requirement in combining the perception of everyone in the party for awareness is something very important in EQ, but much less so in any game afterwards. It's annoying to me that pretty much every option out there is a 3rd person game. There needs to be more 1st person MMO options. More variety.

[Danth]

Originally Posted by Rooj [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know most people don't play EQ in first person, but I do. I only zoom out if I really need to, to look around a corner or see something I normally wouldn't. I've really wanted a 1st person MMO since EQ. The LACK of perception and requirement in combining the perception of everyone in the party for awareness is something very important in EQ, but much less so in any game afterwards. It's annoying to me that pretty much every option out there is a 3rd person game. There needs to be more 1st person MMO options. More variety.

Vanguard had a good first person view mode--better than EQ's even. You could look down and see your body/legs/etc, which EQ does not render. However the game world was still designed with a third person camera in mind, so it was full of massive vaulted ceilings, cavernous interiors, and generally lots of wide-open spaces indoors. It did attempt to have complex dungeons as well with the result being that some of them were so physically enormous that hardly anyone ever did them fully due to lack of time. It was exhibit "A" as to why merely having the view mode available--by itself--isn't enough. The world has to be designed to be seen and played that way.

Lot of pressure nowadays for third person. People love their easymode goodyear blimp perspective.

Danth

[Deathrydar]

Originally Posted by Rooj [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know most people don't play EQ in first person, but I do. I only zoom out if I really need to, to look around a corner or see something I normally wouldn't. I've really wanted a 1st person MMO since EQ. The LACK of perception and requirement in combining the perception of everyone in the party for awareness is something very important in EQ, but much less so in any game afterwards. It's annoying to me that pretty much every option out there is a 3rd person game. There needs to be more 1st person MMO options. More variety.

I play as much as possible in first person. I only change camera angles when I need to watch for roamers/pathers. The game is so much better and immersive while playing in first person. I feel like I have transported out of myself and into my character.

<3 this game!

[Mblake81]

Originally Posted by Vizax_Xaziv [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why have other MMOs failed to capture this feeling? My guess is that it's simply because EverQuest was designed from the ground up to be a first-person experience and thusly getting the sense-of-scale correct was a high priority for them!

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yep, designing worlds for the third person camera severely inhibits world design. Interiors/etc end up massive caverns to give space for zoomed-out cameras to pivot. This in turn almost prohibits the tight, cramped, twisting dungeon style of EQ. Objects like furniture are quite often scaled outsize so as to not appear tiny to a viewer seeing things through a distant camera.

Player/World scale and proportion. I have considered this over the years as well. Danth said it all though.

The first time you seen the wizard spires stretch up to the sky..

[magusfire24]

I always play EQ in first person as well. It is how I grew up with the game. Played since 2001 with Kunark right before Velious I think. Just havent played much in the couple years since my father passed away. His Ranger will never walk the world again.


Looking real forward to playing green with you all and going back to the old days.
Going to just take my sweet time.

[Deathrydar]

Originally Posted by magusfire24 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I always play EQ in first person as well. It is how I grew up with the game. Played since 2001 with Kunark right before Velious I think. Just havent played much in the couple years since my father passed away. His Ranger will never walk the world again.


Looking real forward to playing green with you all and going back to the old days.
Going to just take my sweet time.

Looking forward to it as well, my friend. Sorry to hear about your father! I will be there to take my sweet ole time with you!!!!