Haste and Dual Wield question

[Spacebar]

Is haste better for slower weapons? I'd imagine the answer is no, but just sort of wondering.


Also, is the dual wield chance to hit formula: (level +DW skill)/400 ?

Ex: 60 monk (60+252)/400=78% chance to hit with offhand wep

[Hasbinbad]

Sort of.

Supposedly there is a delay cap of 9 on this server (i have not tested this), so in that sense, haste is better for certain weapons which are slower.

For instance, a moss covered twig (3/10?) would benefit only from ~10% haste, since the modified delay would stop at 9. Any more haste would be wasted on this weapon.

As long as your modified delay is equal to or greater than 9, your weapon is affected by the maximum haste on this server (which i also haven't tested [haste cap]).

[greatdane]

Haste is the same for any kind of weapon. It increases your damage output by a percentage. Whether that's a 10/20 or a 20/40 weapon, 20% haste yields the same increase in damage.

[Troy]

If you're talking about any weapon that is not a Mosscovered Twig, Barbed Scale Whip, or Revultant Whip (Are there any others?) then haste is indeed no better for slower weapons.

[Hasbinbad]

ehh.. efreeti standard.. i dunno, maybe 1 or 2 more..

I just used mct as example because so many people still think it's amazing on this server and get swindled for thousands of plat based on live mechanics way back when, when in reality shit works differently here.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by greatdane [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Haste is the same for any kind of weapon. It decreases your delay by a percentage. Whether that's a 10/20 or a 20/40 weapon, 20% haste yields the same decrease in delay.

fix'd

[baalzy]

Is the cap 9? I'd heard 10, but this is all unconfirmed. I can tell you this though, I don't see anybody 50+ swinging MCTs or BSWs and there is probably a good reason for that.

Regardless, in general more haste = better. The cap should be 100%, which you won't be reaching without dragon haste/sky quest haste. Anything with a delay of at least 20 won't be in danger of hitting a cap (means theres a small chance the jade mace might become slightly less effective if you manage to hit 100% haste, but if you've got that much haste you'd have something better then jade mace anyways).

[Spacebar]

Thanks for clearing that up everybody. Any word on Dual Wield chance to hit calculation?

Regarding haste: I was mostly thinking that if haste lowered the delays of every weapon by the haste %, it would decrease the delay of high-delay weps by more.

Ex: RFS vs IFS (same ratios)
RFS=19/20= 0.95 ----- RFS + FBSS: ~19/17=~1.12
IFS=38/40= 0.95 -------IFS + FBSS: ~38/33=~1.15

Figuring in damage bonuses, RFS would still be better (especially until nerf). But, with more and more haste, it seems the IFS would only improve more and more over the RFS if this is the way haste is calculated.

[soup]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

fix'd

Well, if you want to be technical, the number used when referring to haste represents how many more attacks you get in a given period of time, not how much the delay is lowered.

(you probably know all about it, but just for others who don't)
In other words, if you had a delay of 100, with 20% haste, that does NOT mean your new delay is 80, it means your new delay would be 83.3333 repeating. The formula to determine this is simple, you just take the delay and then divide it by 1+the haste percentage. So for the hypothetical 100 delay weapon and 20% haste, you would do 100/(1+.2) or 100/1.2, which is 83.333 repeating.

People here on p99 are a LOT more aware of this than people were back in the day, but there are probably still people who could benefit from this info.

[soup]

However, what I am not sure about is I have heard that the game doesn't do decimals in the delay, so if that was the case it would mean that in the hypothetical example I used before, rather than the delay being 83.333... it would round to either 83 or 84. I am not sure if this is true, but if it were, it would mean that haste wouldn't entirely be equal for all weapons. It would be very close, but it would allow for potential situations where one weapon could benefit from the haste more fully than another, though the difference would generally be very small.

JUST TO REITERATE ABOUT WHAT I JUST SAID, that is only the case if it's true that delay doesn't go into decimals, and would only be in some situations and dependent on how the rounding is done. If someone knows for sure whether or not that is the case, that would be nice to know.

Although technically I suppose the game must round it off somewhere, since it's not going to process an infinitely long (repeating decimal) number. How far it goes is the real question. If it rounds to whole numbers, there could be situations where one weapon is getting a decent more use out of the haste than another, or if it's rounding to 10 decimal places we would be talking about an extra swing per billions.