Why Classic EQ is still the best online RPG (and how P1999 could make it even better)

[Noudess]

To really understand why classic EQ is/was so successful and such a joy to play, you must first understand what it is based on/evolved from.

The first modern, widespread RPG was the pen and paper Dungeons & Dragons. For those that never played, a quick review is in order. D&D players would create a character using a set of rules put forth by the players guide. This was usually dont on the honor system, but sometimes initial stats were randomly rolled by the Dungeon Master (DM) or what is now commonly referred to as the Game Master (GM). This usually consisted of rolling some # of dice (something like 4d6 or 4 six sided dice) and dropping the low one for each stat. Depending on DM, these could be arranged anyway the player wanted, or taken in the order the stats were rolled. These stats created a base character, which then led to valid choices for race/class. You needed certain minimum stats to be a Paladin for example. So, your random rolls had a lot to do with what you'd be playing. The idea here was to give the player a unique character to role play.

Many GMs allowed creation of characters at varying levels, while others started all they players at level 1, and created higher and higher "modules" for these characters to explore.

The GM/DM often worked within a world, either a world of their own creation, based on literally months of work, or on a published world, such as Greyhawk or Forgotten Realms.

The adventures were tuned to be a challenge to a group of 3-8 adventures of a certain level range. This was to ensure that the module was a challenge, but not a pushover or too hard. Death was often final, or at the very least a substantial loss of XP.

The GM/DM, based on how the party and/or each character performed. granted XP for various acts, completions and monsters killed. XP penalties were applied, when a lawful/good character, for example, committed an evil act. Bonuses were granted when a particular cunning strategy was used to conuer an enemy, or for excellent role playing.

Regardless of all that, the game presented endless possibilities. A world limited only by the imagination of the GM and the enthusiasm of the players. I recall myself spending days working on character development.

When Everquest was first released, it was a dream for D&D players, and fantasy Rpers in general. A massive world, detailed, detailed, detailed. This was a way to play every day, without the need of a local DM/GM, or having to find freinds to play with. Better yet, EQ was created as an RPG - not a shoot em up or video arcade game. It enabled full role playing, along with all the staples of D&D: dungeons, xp, races, classes, gear, etc. Emotes allowed the animations to interact graphically. EQ gave us a wonderful visual world, that mimicked a real world in detail.

Character interactions were essential. Classes needed one another. Bonuses applied to grouping which created wonderful teamwork and strategy. Class skills beautifully complemented each other, be is melee, crowd control, healing, etc.

Finally, a game for a PC that did RPGs justice.

But then, as the popularity grew, and the passion of the developers for a superb world was overcome by real life greed for more profits, EQ started to lose some of its greatness. It was beginning to morph into a single person video game, as the original vision was lost.

Expansions started to give characters items/benefits for buying en expansion.

One of the fundamental precepts of an RPG is the separation of player and character. The character is an entity in his/her own world. He/she should be on the same footing as any other character. Items granted because the player buys an expansion is not in the spirit of an RPG, rather it corrupts it. This led to endless corruptions, more bank space for money, mounts for money, etc.

Instaports everytwhere

The original world was well thought out. Each class had its unique purpose and abilities. The portals, starting with a small compromise (Luclin portals) ended with Planes of Power which made travel trivial. This essentially destroyed the druid/wizard porting aspect, killing interaction even more. Not to mention completely destroying the cities that used to thrive, replacing the all with one large plane of people with culture any longer.

Levels above 60


EQ didnt need levels above 60. Gear got ridiculous. Stats got insane. The whole point of the game was lost. In pen and Paper, we'd just adventure in a new module, enjoying the content with out characters once they reached max level. Adding higher levels destroyed the world balance. I do believe that AA points were a great idea.. giving us something to strive for, but in a realistic world, there must exist a ceiling. You don't tale all characters above the Gods.

We play for the joy of teh game. A new level 1 character in D&D is just as much fun. A new character to develop. Storylines for their past, their personality, etc. And GMs constantly has new modules for us to adventure in - within then world level limits.

Many many other changes exist, as we all know, that destroyed with disregard the original passion and detail that went into Norrath.

And what's funny, is many people didn't realize that all the things that made Norrath like a real world - death, travel, trade skills requiring real effort, all the things they kept complaining about, and getting changed, were the very reasons classic EQ was and is special. It gives us a challenge. It gives us reward. it gives us a realistic environment. We skill up as we DO things. The world was logical, despite being magical. And yet, the player base and greedy Sony corrupted it for money. And now, what is left? A pile of junk over on live.

So... where am I going with this? Well, one, I wanted to post just how much I love classic EQ. And I wanted to share background of where EQ came from, for those that started online, and never knew pen and paper games. For those that perhaps didn't know the origins of things like:

XP - points given for an accomplishment - to a character - not a player - for playing well, defeating a foe, acting in alignment etc.

faction - This isnt just a # that is used to get you a quest.. Faction is how a part of the fantasy society views you. Gaining faction only to betray then is commended it you're evil or chaotic in alignment, but a Lawful or Good character would never do this.

player vs character - Characters are roles you play. If you play multiple characters, they are each their own entity inside the game. They are not all tools to make a player powerful. In Pen and Paper days, your characters did not even know each other existed often.

I also wanted to discuss how P1999 can make Classic EQ even better. This section will probably be flamed, and I guess so be it. So long as you ponder the points from a viewpoint of how the game was intended - where it came from - and frankly why classic EQ is the nest game available. While some of the things below may make YOU less powerful, they make the game a more true representation of a real world that we all get to enjoy forever.

Ok, so what is in classic EQ that is being corrupted today? Or misused? This is stuff I fell violates the intent of the original developers. And I agree with their vision. Some I'm suggesting the server GM fixes, others I am asking players to look at themselves and decide.

XP.


Experience Points. Read those two words. Experience is granted for doing something well, killing an enemy, completing a quest. In EQ, some dungeons grant extra XP. Why? Not because the developers wanted people leveling faster! They grant more XP because a dungeon is a higher risk so there is greater reward. This is being abused badly on P1999. More than half of the people you find in unrest, MM, the other bonus zones have zero risk. They bring a level 60 and they confuse the game into thinking the low level characters made the kill.

Call it what you want... Its abuse of a piece of software that is trying to grant extre reward for extra risk.

Come on people, we have 650+ people online now on P1999 most days. We can have lively of-level groups in tehse zones, like the old days. However, many people, steer clear of these zones now, because how much fun, or immersive is it to see all of unrest including the ghost dragged to the zone line to PL someone?

This is why I propose an XP code change to grant zero experience for mobs 2x your level or more. Hardly a PLing killer, but a little incentive to not get ridiculous. Whether you love Pling, or hate it, It's pretty obvious the XP bonuses are there to reward teamwork of an of-level group - not to get your new level 8 cleric to 20 in a day.

Twinking


I'm not going to propose any changes here. Except by players themselves. I don't think, and I never will. Each of my characters is unique, they're not an extension of my penis, pardon the analogy. They are living , breathing , members of Norrath with personality and background. I believe we just cheapen our Experience by giving them level 40 gear and ignoring the what, dozens of zones we could be grouping in, improving teamwork skills, etc.

That said, its your game, your character, your experience. Nonetheless, if you are at all curious, try playing your next alt like he was your only character. I think you'd be surprised at how much fun it is to be challenged and to actually use that drop you just got instead of mocking it as vendor fodder because your level 60 gave you better, even though he's a troll and you're a wood elf :P

Recharging via vendor


LOL.* I can hear all the l33t people screaming already. What, I can't recharge my leatherfoot helm?

Listen. Do you think the GMs meant for this? Think that the stacking bug on a merchant is intentional?

Hell guys, I've done it. And it makes me feel dirty.

I'd much rather the GMs fixed this bug.. It doesn't even bother me if they create an NPC that specializes in recharging for a fee. At least that would be immersive and in game RP. Taking advantage of this bug is just cheesy and it's a staple on P1999.

MQing


Honestly.*I'm on the fence on this one. I see many instance where this falls into perfect RP. But, I'm sure the devs made the items no drop for this very reason. They didn't want Jboots in the hands of your level 2 warrior.

I'd be happy if they made it not work, but honestly, this falls into the same bucket as twinking. If you MQ, you're making a decision about how you want to experience the game. Earn everything for yourself with each character, or take shortcuts. Personally, as painful as it is to be Sowless, I'll take 35 levels of it for the joy of getting teh jboots with my own two hands once I earn it.

Sorry for the long winded post. I'm dreading the flames, the name calling and the other trolling in general, but do what you must do. My points all have solid basis and its for you all to decide how you feel. I just wanted to take the time to write this, because P1999 is as close to the classic EQ as I've ever seen, and I have to believe its popularity speaks volumes for the original developers vision, that I am trying to uphold.

If you made it this far - 1000 xp granted, unless of course you used someone else that reads faster, or made someone else read 60% of the article for you, in which case you deserve 0 xp.

[Elements]

Sounds like you have some interesting ideas for your own server. Better get to work.

[rekreant]

Originally Posted by Elements [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sounds like you have some interesting ideas for your own server. Better get to work.

[Karafa]

Hey guyz I have some feelings towards classic EQ so lets go ahead and change what has been set in stone for years for meeeeee.

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Karafa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hey guyz I have some feelings towards classic EQ so lets go ahead and change what has been set in stone for years for meeeeee.

Again, do you want bugs that were in classic preserved as well, or just those that benefit you?

[Massive Marc]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again, do you want bugs that were in classic preserved as well, or just those that benefit you?

While we're at it , lets get rid of exp penalty.
fuck druids/wizards lets just put in griffins that everyone can ride across zones.
Maybe we should instance seb and KC ?
shit, might as well put in a auction house.
some battlegrounds maybe ?
Spirit rezer ?

[Itap]

Power-leveling existed in classic EQ. Check

MQing items existed in classic EQ. Check

Recharging items existed in classic EQ. Check

Twinking existed in classic EQ. Check

I see your points, and agree with some of them, but this server was created to mimic a classic era EverQuest. Removing or altering the above listed would be interfering with the devs intentions of creating a classic server.

Determining what or whats not fun is subjective. People loved EverQuest for many reasons, not just the reasons you listed.

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Itap [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Power-leveling existed in classic EQ. Check

MQing items existed in classic EQ. Check

Recharging items existed in classic EQ. Check

Twinking existed in classic EQ. Check

I never said they didn't exist in EQ Classic.

It is obvious that all 4 were not intended by EQclassic developers.

Pling - They made it so if any party member was too high, you got no XP. Obviously PLing techniques are an exploit of that concept.

MQing - They made the items no drop in an attempt to prevent this. MQing is the exploit around this,

Recharging items - Obviously a bug.

Twinking - They didnt create a way to share between characters. You had to drop it or trust someone.

What I was saying is that classic EQ obviosuly did not intend any of these to exist. And I believe they were wise in all 4 cases. The fact that people depend on them now isnt true to EQ classic goals.

Now, if P1999 GMs disagree - long live P1999, I was just noting ways I think the player base, and the Gms could be more true to EQ classic INTENT - not the obvious exploits/bugs. Just because a bug existed - you want it etched in stone? Want them to not fix bugs from classic either?

[Itap]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I never said they didn't exist in EQ Classic.

Yes, but you're suggesting the removal/altering of these things, which is not classic.

This post has been made a dozen times, and it always ends up being the same argument. People want a classic EQ server, yet customized in their own way.

As stated above, better get started.

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Itap [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, but you're suggesting the removal/altering of these things, which is not classic.

This post has been made a dozen times, and it always ends up being the same argument. People want a classic EQ server, yet customized in their own way.

As stated above, better get started.

So bottom line, what do the GMs want here? Classic or Classic Intent by devs?

Also, you guys want this stuff, do you also want all bugs present in classic, or just the ones you can take advantage of?