New Computer Advice

[Branaddar]

So I'm a programmer who is currently contracting work through my local computer repair shop (I live in a small town.) My gaming laptop is slowly biting the dust. The last straw for me was a week or so ago, the GPU and/or PSU is on its last legs.

So my contractor has offered to build me a useable gaming desktop when I finish this phase of the project. So I need some advice.

Criteria:
- Must be relatively inexpensive, keeping in mind he gets some decent deals on hardware. Probably in the $500-1000 range.
- Must be entry-level but still have a lot of room to grow
- Must be able to play games at somewhat-decent settings for now
- Must be able to upgrade while replacing as few parts as possible (ie: adding more RAM, swapping out a cheap GPU for a good one, etc.)
- Custom-built, so no links to Dell or shit like that, please. I want drivers and firmware updates that work properly for a change.
- I've had so many heat issues with this laptop I don't want to deal with potential heat issues from overclocking.
- If possible (haven't looked into this,) I'd like it to support multiple displays through one video card? I do a lot of programming and web design, where it's good to have a reference screen and a development screen.

So I'm thinking, to start off we need a decent Mobo and CPUs. Those should be the highest cost in the rig. Dual cores a must, quads... only if there's a significant performance boost for minimal cost. I can always upgrade that later if need be.

RAM, I can make do with 2gb for now probably.

Video card, something mid-level.

Sound card... I can probably deal with on-board sound and get a decent sound card later, right?

Network, again, on board then upgrade to a wireless (or at least something better) later.

DVD drives and peripherals, don't worry about so much. I'm more concerned about the working components. Been a few years since I kept up on the tech, so I'm a bit out of the loop on whether AMD/Intel or nVidia/ATI are better, and in which cases, etc, etc.

If you could add in "why" you picked the components you did, that would be very helpful for me.

Remember, cost vs performance is my biggest concern, as I will be upgrading this box slowly over the coming months/years, I want a core set of components that will allow for that without wasting too much money.

Thanks in advance!

Edit: Also, don't feel you HAVE to give me advice on each and every component. Even if you just want to chime in about the pros and cons of AMD vs Intel dual-core CPUs, that would help a ton!

[Stickyfingers]

I would suggest something like this...

Parts

CPU: Intel Core i7-930 Processor Boxed
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-225-_-Product

Mobo: GIGABYTE GA-X58A-UD3R LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...D=3463938&SID=

Graphics: Sapphire Radeon Toxic HD 5850
http://www.amazon.com/Sapphire-Rad [...] B003D0IS3K

PSU: Thermaltake TR2 TRX-750M 750W ATX 12V v2.3 / EPS 12V v2.91 80 PLUS Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...D=3463938&SID=


HD: Samsung Spintpoint F3
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-185-_-Product



RAM: G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...D=3463938&SID=

Case: COOLER MASTER RC-692-KKN2 CM690 II Advanced Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6811119216


I took this from elsewhere, but I liked the build for the cost, so I just altered it a bit.


This build would pretty much blow 99.9% of games out of the water.

I am a big fan on intel which is why I picked the i7 as opposed to something more cash efficient.

[Qaedain]

Intel certainly makes the strongest CPUs right the moment (economy aside), but they fall short on the upgrade path: LGA 1366 is a dead socket come mid-2011. Intel's new CPUs won't use any current socket, as the enthusiast-grade CPU uses (approx.) LGA2000.

AMD's socket AM3, on the other hand, is compatible with Bulldozer, AMD's upcoming chip from the same time frame.

If you have upgrades in mind, a Phenom II X4 965 and a good AMD 890FX-based motherboard is the best (and most economical) choice.

Radeon 5830 (or better) for the GPU, and don't get less than 4GB of RAM.

[Branaddar]

I probably shoulda specified better, but the suppliers the guy has access to that give him a discount won't be able to give him anything we want. So I'm more looking for stuff like... "Intel > AMD for dual cores because (blank)" and "This card is a better value than the next level up because you're paying $100 more for a minimal performance boost."

Half your links are busted btw :P

But I looked em up, and that's gonna be a bit expensive for his tastes. Like I said, I just want something with a solid CPU/Mobo foundation for now with minimalist everything else, but still able to play games decently.

I'm not looking to play Crysis 2 on it, I'm looking to play EQ1/2, Team Fortress 2, and some not-so-brand-new games. I do most of my "modern" gaming on my PS3 or 360. So I don't want to be spending $2000 on this rig.

I can't go up to the guy and be all "here's the parts I need, they'll cost you $1500." He'll laugh at me.

[Branaddar]

Originally Posted by Qaedain [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Stuff

Awesome, thanks. That's some good info. Did some quick searching, looks like those CPUs/mobos are about the price I was thinking of spending on thos components.

I may end up cheaping out on video card/RAM initially. I'm more looking at this as getting free parts from my boss than an entirely good computer, then upgrading it as I have excess money.

I'll probably start with a mobo/cpu at least similar to those, if he can get them.

[Qaedain]

To expound a bit, I have some recommendations for a good budget system that's very reliable and will be eligible for upgrades with quality parts over the next 2-3 years:

Gigabyte GA-890FXA-UD5: Approx $180
AMD Phenom II X4 965 (specifically part# HDZ965FBGMBOX): Approx $180
AMD Radeon HD 5850 (any company): Approx $300
4GB DDR3-1600 from OCZ, Corsair, Kingston, Crucial or G.SKILL: Approx $115
A 1TB HDD from Seagate or Western Digital: Approx $80


Cases are, of course, totally discretionary, but here are some good ones: Antec 300, Antec 900, AZZA Solano, NZXT Hades. These have quality builds, good materials and excellent airflow, not to mention low noise. A good case runs about $100.

Total price is approximately $955.

WHY AMD CPU?:
Intel's current CPUs and motherboards are not compatible with their next generation, which launches in 2011. AMD's are. AMD CPUs are also 5-10% slower than Intel CPUs, per MHz, but you'll save hundreds.

WHY AMD GPU?:
AMD is leading innovation in the GPU market. First to DirectX 11, better prices, better power savings, better heat. They're 6-8 months ahead of NVIDIA when it comes to releasing newer, better GPUs. The 5850 is a very solid card that should give an average gamer 2-3 years.

The rest of my part selections are based on long-term quality evaluations and the expected amenities of a modern, but economical home-built PC.

DISCLAIMER: I have been a reporter/analyst for a large tech site for nearly 10 years. I've touched hundreds and thousands of pieces of hardware, and am paid to understand the computer industry for several hundred thousand monthly readers. It is in my best interest to be on point.

[Stickyfingers]

Originally Posted by Branaddar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I probably shoulda specified better, but the suppliers the guy has access to that give him a discount won't be able to give him anything we want. So I'm more looking for stuff like... "Intel > AMD for dual cores because (blank)" and "This card is a better value than the next level up because you're paying $100 more for a minimal performance boost."

Half your links are busted btw :P

But I looked em up, and that's gonna be a bit expensive for his tastes. Like I said, I just want something with a solid CPU/Mobo foundation for now with minimalist everything else, but still able to play games decently.

I'm not looking to play Crysis 2 on it, I'm looking to play EQ1/2, Team Fortress 2, and some not-so-brand-new games. I do most of my "modern" gaming on my PS3 or 360. So I don't want to be spending $2000 on this rig.

I can't go up to the guy and be all "here's the parts I need, they'll cost you $1500." He'll laugh at me.

Hmm, you said 500-1000$ and that build is close to the 1000$ mark.

Also, good info Qaedain, I did not know that the 1366 socket was going to be obsolete soon. However, I would say an I7-930 should last you for at least 6 to 7 years, interms of it being powerful enough.

AMD is nice because its cheaper and still very powerful, but I have had some trouble with them in the past.

[Branaddar]

Sorry, Sticky. Didn't mean to sound like I was totally dismissing your post, I took it to heart as well [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When the time rolls around I'll try to get a better feel for what he's willing to spend, but I imagine it's not going to be much. I'll see what his prices are on the AMD mobo/cpu vs the newer Intels. I'll go with AMD in terms of upgradability, but if he can get a good price on a good Intel that won't need upgrading for years to come, then that may be a good way to go.

His suppliers have big price fluctuations from MSRP, so it's hard to say yet [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] It's part of why I want to know why X is better than Y and so on.

Appreciate all the tips so far guys, thanks!

[Ropethunder]

Just as an FYI I've got a refurbished (like new) HP laptop with a ton of accessories and full warranty I'm selling really cheap, if you're still looking to go the laptop route.

The most important specs are:

Model: Pavilion dv2700t
CPU: Core 2 Duo 2.54Ghz
Mem: 4GB
Video: GeForce 8400GS
HDD: 250GB

I can provide full specs and accessory information if you're interested. The transaction would be done through ebay.

[Stickyfingers]

Originally Posted by Branaddar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sorry, Sticky. Didn't mean to sound like I was totally dismissing your post, I took it to heart as well [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When the time rolls around I'll try to get a better feel for what he's willing to spend, but I imagine it's not going to be much. I'll see what his prices are on the AMD mobo/cpu vs the newer Intels. I'll go with AMD in terms of upgradability, but if he can get a good price on a good Intel that won't need upgrading for years to come, then that may be a good way to go.

His suppliers have big price fluctuations from MSRP, so it's hard to say yet [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] It's part of why I want to know why X is better than Y and so on.

Appreciate all the tips so far guys, thanks!

Meh, it's all good haha, I just enjoy fucking around with computers and building them =P(I am a current CS major). It seems like Qaedain knows what he's talking about though haha.


Also, Qaedain is from Detroit, so don't trust him. Only trust people from Michigan if they are from Grand Rapids lol.