Why Classic EQ is still the best online RPG (and how P1999 could make it even better)

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Ele [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Without getting into whether or not these things should be implemented here. (They should not). It is an interesting exercise to see what mistakes or just simple shortsightedness Verant/Sony had when making the game and updating it along the way.

The developers back in 1997-99 had no idea that EQ would be as popular as it was or that it would spawn the progeny of games that it did. The developers thought most people would never get past their 30s; however, the uber guild/power gamer crowd quickly proved them wrong and incidentally are the ones most likely to pull up an emulated server.

Capping stats at 200/255 in the first few expansions. Didn't leave any growing room.

Recharging.

Feign Death mechanics.

Lack of significant money sinks.

Primal weapons.

21/36/41% haste items in first release. Best haste % available before the first expansion even dropped.

Complete Healing was a huge oversight, which only got better as time went on. It also became the basis for new encounters to be measured by, rather than coming up with strategies or interesting mechanics, just make the mob hit harder and faster requiring more precision in the CH chain.

Great post.

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Massive Marc [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm quite happy with the way things are here. Clearly, you're not. My point, which flew over your head, was that, it's a slippery slope when you start changing classic elements based on subjective reasoning.

Actually Marc - I couldn't agree with you more on the above. I just don't consider the 4 things I mentioned to be a clasic element - anymore than any other bug. They are bugs or exploits abusing a bug.

Applied to anything other than exploits or bugs - I'd agree totally.

[Massive Marc]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All 4 are exploits or bugs. Not even debatable Against intent of developers - hence exploit/bug.

I do not want to change anything that isn't an exploit or bug. If I did, I would not have come to this server. I hate what EQ changed into, which was obvious had you read my entire post. It was novel length because some people don't fathom the idea that EQ itself is an evolution of an existing game. The entire genre would not exist if not for role players.

Why so angry? Could it be that you are afraid of having to actually play the game as it was intended instead of using every cheat/trick you can find? Classic EQ also had items disappear in tradeskills if you made a mistake - want that back?

I don't mind a discussion, or even conceding points. But the stronghest argument the few of you have is that the things I mention were in classic EQ. But you're fine with taking other bugs out that AID your levelling/xp.

You're either trolling or just can't understand logic. The other people aside form the on random guy that spit out 4 useless words, all made logical, rational arguments. You can't answer the one I asked. Do you wants bugs fixed? If so, that's not true classic either, and invalidates your entire argument.

I don't even know...

Like I think your serious, which is kind of sad... but part of me thinks I'm getting trolled.

So, to sum up... if you have a BUG that needs to be fixed, submit said bug to the Bugs thread and I'm sure they'll fix it.

[Slave]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...the decision lies in the hands of the great people who set this server up. I bow to whatever they decide.

They decided long ago that none of the things you have mentioned are bugs or exploits. Pretty much nobody thinks that. That is basically some pretty fucked up conspiracy shit you're spouting, real tin foil hat kind of stuff with absolutely zero evidence whatsoever to back it up, and truly assloads of developer interviews, patch notes, and official announcements to counter it. I would just reroll a new forum account if I were you.

[Ele]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All 4 are exploits or bugs. Not even debatable Against intent of developers - hence exploit/bug.

I do not want to change anything that isn't an exploit or bug. If I did, I would not have come to this server. I hate what EQ changed into, which was obvious had you read my entire post. It was novel length because some people don't fathom the idea that EQ itself is an evolution of an existing game. The entire genre would not exist if not for role players.

Part of the difficultly of the 4 "bugs/exploits" you originally identified were that all of them existed in classic EQ. They were also all used to some extent. However, P99 represents an interesting piece of the EQ pie, most people that pull up the EMU servers are people that want to either relive their uber guild past, achieve an uber status they did not get to experience previously, or just soak up the nostalgia.

Players that come to play on this server have the ability to know every single drop, quest, hotspot, patch deadline well ahead of time. Players can pick out their desired progression and create a plan of attack, if you will, for itemization and leveling. This did not exist back in the 1999-2001 era, everything was fresh and unknown to most of the player base. P99 everything is known, all the "exploits" and "bugs" that existed and were used and kept underground from 1999-2001 are rampant because they are well known now.

Another issue with all this is the length of time between expansions and the lower over all player density. The ratio of mobs/players is much higher than any live server allowing people to level far faster than they did on live. The length of time also allows people to accumulate more wealth, alts, items between expansions resulting in even more issues of overcrowding/farming. On live, the majority of people didn't have time for that, they had to level and explore new areas rather than knowing to go to point A, then B, then C and finishing quests/levels in minutes/hours rather than days/weeks/months.


Regarding the double level = no xp, this would be quickly nullified after level 4 or 5. In terms of efficiency it is counterproductive to have the PL'ee swing on a level 30 mob at level 15, and even then you can pull a level 29 mob for him and he would then get full exp.

Twinking was solved on special rule set servers such as Firiona Vie; however, it was still rampant along with two-boxing on regular servers.

Recharging happened all the time, it was just less known to the general populace; however, everyone knows about it here so it makes it a more widespread issue.

MQing was allowed on live. Having a container combine is a stop gap to MQing issues, such as warrior epic, enchanter epic, Monk RoLC, etc, but those are few and far between. It may violate the spirit of the quest, but it is well within the rules of the game.

[Itap]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So bottom line, what do the GMs want here?

They have made this perfectly clear, numerous times

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Slave [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They decided long ago that none of the things you have mentioned are bugs or exploits. Pretty much nobody thinks that. That is basically some pretty fucked up conspiracy shit you're spouting, real tin foil hat kind of stuff with absolutely zero evidence whatsoever to back it up, and truly assloads of developer interviews, patch notes, and official announcements to counter it. I would just reroll a new forum account if I were you.

So you're saying they intended:

selling a used up item after a non-used up one and getting 2 non used ones back?

having a level 12 get xp from a 30 mob via some contorted battle?

MQing items they intentionally made no drop?

Show me any proof of that. They are all such bastardizations of intended functionality and you think its consipracy? Can you back any of that up? No. Its just people*not wanting to give up cheats.

[Noudess]

Originally Posted by Itap [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They have made this perfectly clear, numerous times

Point me to it - and thread over. But it has to be specific.

[Itap]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So you're saying they intended:

selling a used up item after a non-used up one and getting 2 non used ones back?

having a level 12 get xp from a 30 mob via some contorted battle?

MQing items they intentionally made no drop?

Show me any proof of that. They are all such bastardizations of intended functionality and you think its consipracy? Can you back any of that up? No. Its just people*not wanting to give up cheats.

Dude, why are you beating a dead horse? We all know devs made changes to the original EQ, but it didnt happen till expansions later (I.E. removing hybrid penalties, improving all melee skills to be equivalent to warriors, ect).

This emulated server isn't "Lets create original EverQuest, yet modify it so that it makes certain individuals happy, because we know that's what the original developers would have wanted".

This is a recreation of original EverQuest, along with all the original rules and original gameplay.

[Itap]

Originally Posted by Noudess [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Point me to it - and thread over. But it has to be specific.

I seriously do not have the time, nor want to search through thousands of posts to prove to you that the developers of the project want to keep things classic.

Heres the first post I found by doing a simple search

Originally Posted by Rogean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...But regardless, this is a "Classic" server, with the intention of stopping at Velious. If you want to play Planes of Power, you can play PEQ...